Fee Free Investing - feedback please?

Hi Pynksters,

We’ve come back in to 2020 fully charged with lots of new thinking about how we will build Pynk over the next 10 years - and how we will make Pynk the world’s most inclusive investment platform.

One of the big ideas we have been thinking about is ‘Fee Free’ Investing. RobinHood (US and soon to be UK) and FreeTrade (Europe) are offering this already, but they are essentially exchanges only - some traders and investors on these platforms could lose money. As you know Pynk will be a managed investment account; whereby our Crowd Wisdom System (Crowd data+AI+expert analysis) determines the portfolio allocation across Stocks, Bonds, Commodities, Precious Metals, FX and Crypto.

We are considering a minimum requirement from Pynksters of 2 price predictions per week in order to qualify for fee free investing. This helps the Pynk collective since we need consistency of data. On an individual level; fee free investing will equate to significant increased returns over time thanks to compounding effect, and making consistent predictions helps users learn more about investing i.e. it’s a learning through doing experience and will become super-predictors. Our data is already showing significant improvement in the Crowd’s ability to predict, with an increased rate of Super-predictors in the Crowd.

To be clear, we may have to pass on some costs. For example if the portfolio allocation decides on ETFs there is usually a small charge of c. 0.15% that we need pass on. FreeTrade and the like also do this. Despite this the total cost would be significantly less than the current average of c.1% for retail investors.

So how would Pynk the company make money? We would charge High Net Worth and Institutional investors a fee for Assets Under Management. In this way we are redistributing value from the wealthy to everyday investors (in return for their contribution to the Crowd Wisdom system).

Would be great to get your initial thoughts on likes / dislikes with this model? And any suggestions?

Thanks!

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This sounds amazing and very smart :nerd_face:
Fee free for everyday investors is a good incentive to not just invest but to become a part of Pynk community.

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This PYNK thing is getting more interesting every day.

Very smart way to create synergie and consistency for every people in the prediction side. GREAT IDEA.

If those players agree join this model it is “soooooo good!”

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Fee free online investing is becoming more common. TdAmeritrade, E-Trade and Charles Schwab --to name a few-- are now offering it. So yes, I agree with that idea. I do think a requirement of predicting helps Pynk, but it should.be more than twice a week. (2 days out of 7 doesn’t really show commitment,) I would up that to 3 or 4 days. All in all, great plans and very exciting for the future of Pynk!

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Fee free is gaining momentum and since Pynk is for the people, I think it’s a good idea. With that said, I would like to say that Pynk isn’t an NGO or a charity organization and therefore to whom much is given, much is expected. This fee free investing should be a reward package for committed pynkstars and the 2 times prediction is too low and should be increased to 5 across all assets. Rose depends on the crowds prediction. We all want financial inclusion but I believe we all have a role to play in order to succeed.

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I’d agree with @kaabayahaya to.some extent, although maybe 5 is too high. The phrase that we used in some of our Facebook flows ‘a little hard work for a fair reward’ seems to make sense here.

How will that apply to those who just want to.invest money though? Would they then be charged and, if so, wouldn’t that be a deterrent for them?

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@kaabayahaya @Al_Wallace some thoughts on this;

  • maybe we could have a ladder of some sort, X predictions per week/month = fee free investing. Anything less than that and you will get charged a fee depending on how many predictions make. If zero predictions then pay full fee. Or maybe that’s way too complicated?

  • we still want to reward the top 10k of Crowd in return for their efforts, after-all they are contributing the highest quality data; one day we will have 10k Super predictors. But imagine if the crowd was even bigger and we had 100k+ from around the world - that was the thinking that in order to qualify for the Pynk ‘fee free’ investing platform you have to contribute to the Crowd in some capacity. That said, feels dictatorial to say ‘no’ you can’t ba a part of this if not contributing to the Crowd - def not the Pynk way of doing things as we are trying to reduce barriers, not put them up! But then is it fair to Crowd members that non-contributors also enjoy fee free? I think could be, after-all Crowd members are ‘learning through doing’ and becoming super predictors and super investors over time…and hopefully having some fun in the process

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Crowd members will still, presumably be recieving rewards through shares though. To be honest the more I think about it there’s so much competition coming onto the market putting that barrier of a fee for those who don’t have time to invest money (often because they are busy, not because of any negative reason let’s bear in mind) might make them go elsewhere.

Free trade are just about to open their fund, it’s just passed beta stage so there are products offering similar options to investors, although clearly Pynk has the advantage because of crowd wisdom :nerd_face:

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AGREE 100% with this.

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It needs to be as simple as possible, ladder thing seems a bit complicated.
It sounds fair that you pay a fee if you predict and no fee if you predict couple of times a week.
Predicting 2 times a week and 8 times a month the same asset could be just enough to motivate people to predict with enough thought process and not just put a number so they complete the task.
And if they like it they will probably predict more and if they don’t they will pay the fee.

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I believe those who want to invest only money will be made aware of the percentage fee to be paid for managing their investment. The fee is significantly less than the current average of c.1% for retail investors. I think that’s fair. Not everyone will be interested in predicting so fee free investment should be a reward scheme for committed loyal pynkstars. Those who put in not just money but time and effort as well.

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Spot on. I totally agree with you. :smile:

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:champagne:
Exactly. You just interpreted the complicated ladder analogy :laughing:

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@kaabayahaya I mean that a simple ladder is OK but there shouldn’t be a couple of different fees, just 1 or no fee :smiley:

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Thanks for feedback everyone, this really helps. We got some thinking to do on this then, and to crunch some numbers. Will report back on this thread. Btw if see examples for other fee free investment platforms share here or related info, would be good to see :+1:

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I think freetrade are about to launch something but I’m not 100% on the details as it’s just finished it’s beta stage which I wasn’t involved in. Also trading212 offer a range of zero free products, fractional shares etc.

As Karen mentioned this is big in the US and seriously making a dent in some investment bankers pockets and so I’d expect to see it take off big style here soon too.

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Yes, in principle, all the conditions of the model suit and please the ‘honor’ from Rose AI. Received an award of …000 $ cp and now more enthusiasm for predictions​:+1: And what they say about days, so everything happens in life … the number of days for predictions is justified! And you should understand that if someone falls out (due to the days of predictions), others come to his place, you won’t get more profit in your pocket :exclamation::exclamation::exclamation:
“To be clear, we may have to pass on some costs…” I would like to clarify the percentage of what amount%? And approximate numbers%

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Hi! I thought I’m just participating in forecasts. It turned out that I participate in investing for free. I could not even think of such a thing. I like. Thanks! When will we see the platform and be able to sell-buy our interest? :smile: :smile:

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This one sounds good.
Continue to the promise will better to improve the growth on the top level…
:raised_hands::raised_hands::raised_hands::raised_hands::raised_hands:

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